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 serpents base rush on dragon

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{[LB]}-DunKing__

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PostSubject: serpents base rush on dragon   Mon Jan 18, 2010 8:12 pm

Here is one more tactic:

Build a hut in your base and set rall point to enemys base, build a hut there and 2 tavern ( first look what he does if double spear get one tavern and one alchemist hut) .
If he makes chemist hes lost!
if he makes an archer place one peasant behind a tavern so that archer on tower is trying to shot him but hits tavern. Keep that peas alive at same place and u can kill tower easy.
After that he should be done
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{[BRD]}Playername

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PostSubject: Re: serpents base rush on dragon   Wed Jan 20, 2010 6:59 pm

Hmmm... I do not agree:

I have seen this tactic used against wolf (it always kills me Very Happy ), but never against dragon. I guess double spearmans can counter it because spear kills sword in 1v1 and musketers would not be helpful enough (if dragon player have at least some skills). Also, dragon would have advantage in numbers as he could start building troops faster than serpent.

But its about nothing. While playing versus serpent, dragon will always begin game with archer tower. Sword rush launched from start position fails to it in 95% of all cases. So you advice to use tavern and peasant to distract tower's fire? I dont know about others, but it looks like extremely dirty trick for me. It simply destroys sense in game.
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{[LB]}-DunKing__

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PostSubject: Re: serpents base rush on dragon   Wed Jan 20, 2010 7:12 pm

{[BRD]}Playername wrote:
Hmmm... I do not agree:

I have seen this tactic used against wolf (it always kills me Very Happy ), but never against dragon. I guess double spearmans can counter it because spear kills sword in 1v1 and musketers would not be helpful enough (if dragon player have at least some skills). Also, dragon would have advantage in numbers as he could start building troops faster than serpent.

But its about nothing. While playing versus serpent, dragon will always begin game with archer tower. Sword rush launched from start position fails to it in 95% of all cases. So you advice to use tavern and peasant to distract tower's fire? I dont know about others, but it looks like extremely dirty trick for me. It simply destroys sense in game.


Well double spearman is one of the worst thing a dragon can do

look u run there and build a hut, then u look what enemy builds:

-If he builds 2 Dojo u build 2 alchemist huts and he is done, or musk on tower and he is even more done.

-If he builds a dojo first, u build similar to it one alchemist hut, if he makes chemist then u start second building with sword , or if u want u can try to get canons and hes done again

-If he makes double archer u make double sword or musk and hes doen again

- so the only possibility is archer on tower, but u can place a peas behind tavern how i said already. Well if u say it destroys the game thats ure opinion, when the ppl found out that smoke burns buildings they said the same, but they got used to it. Anyway each " dirty " trick can be countered also wich makes the game just more interesting.
For example u can try to kill the peas behind tavern with peas or archer or whatever and tower will start shoting the units. Thats not a problem it just depends on wich player contorls his units better at that moment, a lot of ppl survived that easy by killing the peas.
I see that ppl always say it destroys the game if there is something new
hmm...
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{[BRD]}Playername

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PostSubject: Re: serpents base rush on dragon   Thu Jan 21, 2010 1:56 am

Well, smoke burning effect isnt bug. But continous smoke shooting is. And everyone abuses it nowadays while id (there is nothing bugged or even overpowered about this bg) is practically banned... Its simple logic: normally canoner needs to reload his weapon after every shot; he also can carry only 4 smoke bombs normally. But with smoke bug use everything is different. It doesnt make canoners unstoppable, but it gives enormous and unfair boost to their effectivness. Why dont we use balista bug to finish ruining of game? Or superpush? Or lotus yin and town hall cheats?
Ok, this is another story, lets go back to current theme:
Towers never atack buildings (excluding enemy towers) by itself. Usage of a peasant for distraction method you have described includes exploiting of inability to control tower's targeting in a very wrong way. Still, I think that with big doze of luck mixed with serpent's mistakes, dragon is able to prevent this sick plan from success.
No, to main point: why does a good serpent player ever need to come along with this tactic? Maybe serpent hasnt enough fair rush schemes; lets count: double sword; double musket; musket plus sword; mounted swors; sniper; tower - overall no less than six. And still he needs to use most rigged of them all. Why, just to WIN by any cost, eh? So, it seems victories worth more than fun for some persons. Well, its their choice; i have nothing against it.
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{[LB]}-DunKing__

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PostSubject: Re: serpents base rush on dragon   Thu Jan 21, 2010 5:00 pm

{[BRD]}Playername wrote:
Well, smoke burning effect isnt bug. But continous smoke shooting is. And everyone abuses it nowadays while id (there is nothing bugged or even overpowered about this bg) is practically banned... Its simple logic: normally canoner needs to reload his weapon after every shot; he also can carry only 4 smoke bombs normally. But with smoke bug use everything is different. It doesnt make canoners unstoppable, but it gives enormous and unfair boost to their effectivness. Why dont we use balista bug to finish ruining of game? Or superpush? Or lotus yin and town hall cheats?
Ok, this is another story, lets go back to current theme:
Towers never atack buildings (excluding enemy towers) by itself. Usage of a peasant for distraction method you have described includes exploiting of inability to control tower's targeting in a very wrong way. Still, I think that with big doze of luck mixed with serpent's mistakes, dragon is able to prevent this sick plan from success.
No, to main point: why does a good serpent player ever need to come along with this tactic? Maybe serpent hasnt enough fair rush schemes; lets count: double sword; double musket; musket plus sword; mounted swors; sniper; tower - overall no less than six. And still he needs to use most rigged of them all. Why, just to WIN by any cost, eh? So, it seems victories worth more than fun for some persons. Well, its their choice; i have nothing against it.

Ok to ure first point:

So u think nothing is more overbuged or powerful then ID? Thats wrong. Those things u call Overpowered or bugs are those who ppla rent able counter, thats why they say it, thats the only reason. If those ppl are going to use their brain they wont let the enemy get ID first at all. U forget the Time, this one of the most importat components of BR.
Seems like most players didnt realize that, each thing that u called over powered ot overbuged has also bad sites:

-ID needs a lot time while someone is going to make ID he in danger to get kileld fast.
If he still gets them u ahve a lot of choices, mug them, vet them, sc them,.... so where is the problem. U could also say That werewolves are overpowered with their speed and Bg wich they use to hit and run. If u fight ID just get the right units like fully upgraded lava rocks wich is very useful to fight dragon.I could say many more but this should be enough for first. And ID is not Banned noone can say that ID is banned, the only thing they can do is to ask if ID is allowed or not, if one of thoe players want still to use ID he should do it ( i must say ID is usually used if both teams have an dragon to make it easier)

-Smoke, also needs time 6 horses willd estroy all of them it doesnt matter if they smome or not. U could also be able to not even let him smoke, for example with snieps or balista they will always shot the units who smokes. Here u can also use werewolves or SC ( ic ant understand how us ay ID is most overbuged without speaking about Sc because its even more powerful) If smoke would be so overpowered like u say, serpent would always overrun dragon with smoke, wich is not reality.

- At last to the tower, i can just say what i said before , each tactic even those looking so "unfair" or "bugged" can be countered easy. Well and noone ever said that a serpent needs to use this its just one more posibility to kill the enemy, i think those many posibilitys are the thing wich makes our BR so good. And the tower doest shot building hes just trying to shot unit but hits the buuilding ( well maybe its the same ^^)
There is also the easy choice to reenter tower .

"So, it seems victories worth more than fun for some persons. Well, its their choice; i have nothing against it."

Well i have to say that each person gets his fun by other ways, maybe this is no fun to u but i guess there are a lot who have fun with it
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vindict

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PostSubject: Re: serpents base rush on dragon   Fri Jan 22, 2010 5:54 pm

{[BRD]}Playername wrote:
Hmmm... I do not agree:

I have seen this tactic used against wolf (it always kills me Very Happy ), but never against dragon. I guess double spearmans can counter it because spear kills sword in 1v1 and musketers would not be helpful enough (if dragon player have at least some skills). Also, dragon would have advantage in numbers as he could start building troops faster than serpent.

But its about nothing. While playing versus serpent, dragon will always begin game with archer tower. Sword rush launched from start position fails to it in 95% of all cases. So you advice to use tavern and peasant to distract tower's fire? I dont know about others, but it looks like extremely dirty trick for me. It simply destroys sense in game.

Spear can't kill sword 1v1 not without BG
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vindict

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PostSubject: Re: serpents base rush on dragon   Fri Jan 22, 2010 6:15 pm

{[LB]}-DunKing__ wrote:
Here is one more tactic:

Build a hut in your base and set rall point to enemys base, build a hut there and 2 tavern ( first look what he does if double spear get one tavern and one alchemist hut) .
If he makes chemist hes lost!
if he makes an archer place one peasant behind a tavern so that archer on tower is trying to shot him but hits tavern. Keep that peas alive at same place and u can kill tower easy.
After that he should be done

Yep sounds good enough, but what if the dragon player finds out your plot and goes with soldiers between the tavern and your base, then he can cut the commin peasents and ruin the rush... I still think that the best way to deffend against a sword rush is with a tower right in the beggining and 1 or 2 spearmen to drive the attention of the swords aaway from the tower so the chemic guy can pwn them xD
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[BRAS][Mage]Crow

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PostSubject: Re: serpents base rush on dragon   Fri Jan 22, 2010 9:50 pm

@ vindict 1st try 1-1 spear vs sword, before post those ****

of course without hill boni or upgrades

Quote :
Yep sounds good enough, but what if the dragon player finds out your plot and goes with soldiers between the tavern and your base, then he can cut the commin peasents and ruin the rush... I still think that the best way to deffend against a sword rush is with a tower right in the beggining and 1 or 2 spearmen to drive the attention of the swords aaway from the tower so the chemic guy can pwn them xD

u didnt read carfully, as dunk said, time is an important factor

so before u got 1-2 units in your base the serp will get atleast 1 unit and kill urs with peas

how u wanna do tower and spear? maybe tower without any missile unit
and " drive the attention of the swords aaway from the tower" it isnt the same to play vs a bot-.-
every player will attack ur tower...
why the fuck chemists??

so u wanna build dojo+hut+tower+alchemist hut+2 spears+1 chemist=215 rice( u had 300 at beginning)
215 rice= 15 rice sacks
before u got these, a wave of swords kill ur base....
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vindict

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PostSubject: Re: serpents base rush on dragon   Fri Jan 22, 2010 9:55 pm

the calculation of the rice differs from the starting resources option... I dont say it's easy I just think that this is the only way... Dragon clan NEEDS a tower in the begging all of their 1 and even 2 Tier units are weak without bg and upgrades...

Why chemist ??? cuz chemist hut is the cheapest building for soldiers you can have in the beginning... and even if you dont have a dojo I think that a tower will be a great help... swords will raze it slowly and you can attack with peasents if they are focused on the tower... when they turn on the peasents you run... if they follow the chemist strikes if they dont you repeat...

I had survived a sword rush on freedom with dragon, but I wasn't playing vs a very good player still I think it is possible
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{[LB]}-DunKing__

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PostSubject: Re: serpents base rush on dragon   Sun Jan 24, 2010 4:20 pm

I have to say this i really an dam,n good strategy if u do it well u might win each game vs drag
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[BRAS]Kiwi

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PostSubject: Re: serpents base rush on dragon   Sun Jan 24, 2010 8:07 pm

dunk is right.. this base rush is really helpful against dragon and it works perfect Smile
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[DreaD]~~Kiera~~

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PostSubject: Re: serpents base rush on dragon   Mon Jan 25, 2010 6:41 pm

{[LB]}-DunKing__ wrote:
Here is one more tactic:

Build a hut in your base and set rall point to enemys base, build a hut there and 2 tavern ( first look what he does if double spear get one tavern and one alchemist hut) .
If he makes chemist hes lost!
if he makes an archer place one peasant behind a tavern so that archer on tower is trying to shot him but hits tavern. Keep that peas alive at same place and u can kill tower easy.
After that he should be done

i wud really like it if u wud show that serpent rush on my dragon!!
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NekRoManT

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PostSubject: Re: serpents base rush on dragon   Mon Jan 25, 2010 11:31 pm

easy my baby Smile
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{[BRD]}DarK_FirE™

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PostSubject: Re: serpents base rush on dragon   Mon Jan 25, 2010 11:56 pm

hahaha baby xD
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DuanTaiTu段太图

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PostSubject: Re: serpents base rush on dragon   Tue Jan 26, 2010 10:37 am

Wow, my base rush is so popular Razz
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PostSubject: Re: serpents base rush on dragon   Tue Jan 26, 2010 7:57 pm

did u used base rush first ?
because i don't know who Smile

but i know who used 2 taverns on base of drag first Smile
later i started copy this
it's was hobbit
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{[BRD]}DarK_FirE™

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PostSubject: Re: serpents base rush on dragon   Tue Jan 26, 2010 9:05 pm

ya hobbit killed me with 2 tavern base rush lol
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DuanTaiTu段太图

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PostSubject: Re: serpents base rush on dragon   Tue Jan 26, 2010 10:56 pm

NekRoManT wrote:
did u used base rush first ?
because i don't know who Smile

but i know who used 2 taverns on base of drag first Smile
later i started copy this
it's was hobbit

Yes, I used it first on 2003 Smile It was because Melk was doing same type of rush to me, but he does not build on my base, he build like on the TOP of my BASE, then that give me the idea of rushing in my opponent's base. After that, many people call it "Ben's Base RUSH" but after 2005, not much anymore, and now, people does not know it was me who started it Razz

The popularity of SC was started by TERA Razz also known as KOSMOS back on 2004.
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[{BeatZ}]Daye

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PostSubject: Re: serpents base rush on dragon   Sat Jan 30, 2010 3:27 am

i learned this rush from my best br friend.

1. build hut (rally to your enemy's base)
2. build hut at your enemy's base
3. tower up (i'm sure that your opponent will make chemist)
4. make tavern ( get swords)
5. if you got more resources (make tavern at your own base, it helps you to make swords faster or whenever your enemy tried to change base with you, you got an extra tavern to stop him.)

hope you guys likes it..

cheers
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NekRoManT

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PostSubject: Re: serpents base rush on dragon   Sat Jan 30, 2010 4:08 am

daye wrote:
i learned this rush from my best br friend.

3. tower up (i'm sure that your opponent will make chemist)

cheers
yes opponent made chemist and see that u make swords
then he make dodjo and can get kabuki or spearmens
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[{BeatZ}]Daye

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PostSubject: Re: serpents base rush on dragon   Sat Jan 30, 2010 10:11 am

well, probably.. but the tower can weaken kabuki. but whatever, im just sharing some tactics. xD Idea aha
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PostSubject: Re: serpents base rush on dragon   Sun Jan 31, 2010 12:29 pm

And what if the dragon player make mounted archers ??? they will work just fine vs swords and vs musks too... you say musk > archer that's true for 1v1 but more archers > more musks and since at this rush the dragon has the advantage of beginning first he would most likely have more archers. I think the best way to rush mounted archer dragon is to rush him with mounted sword Razz In fact mounted sword rush works perfect on dragon whatever he is making... That's what I think.
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PostSubject: Re: serpents base rush on dragon   Sun Jan 31, 2010 1:15 pm

u wont get enough horses in base, rush just count the rice costs
300 from beginning - hut(50) - target range(125) - stables(150) = 25 rice left
stables need "long" time to build in rush, and when u use 4-5 peas u got a rice disadvantage, then the peas have to gain horses, while u train archers

before u got 1-2 mounted archer serp will build a hut,tower,alchemist hut and few musk, the tower flashs ur horses and then they are useless ---> fail <---
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PostSubject: Re: serpents base rush on dragon   Sun Jan 31, 2010 1:55 pm

hmm you are correct if the serp manages to build the tower... not quite sure tugh I never had to defend against this rush... just thinking... WEll watchtower is slow to build either besides serp will need hmm let's see 1 hut at his rice 1 hut at my rice 1 alchemic and 1 tower 50 + 50 + 125 + 150 right ? 325 kinda same thing.... it depends on where is the tower IMO if dragon clan have about 4 mounted archers he will keep his distance from tower and just attacking peas or musks and if he makes swords.. trample can handle them... and if the dragon manages to cut off the musks comming he can manage to kill lthe tower with peas even... Usually serp has the advantage but we forget that he must run to the location of the dragon ... at the time drag clan will almost have an archery and about 30% of the stables...

Yet again I am not that sure it will work... just analyzing
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[BRAS][Mage]Crow

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PostSubject: Re: serpents base rush on dragon   Mon Feb 01, 2010 7:05 pm

u cant analyze before u defend or use this tactic

any other oppinions here?
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